FOREIGNER: Discussion Post #6

[krait]

This is the discussion post for chapter 9-13.

I am now heartily wishing that I'd looked at chapter content as well as at page-counts, when setting up the reading schedule! (I thought even then it might bite me, and it has!) This reading was composed of a hundred pounds of action, a hundred pounds of disconnected info-bites, a thousand pounds of questions, and half a gram of explanations! My brain was churning faster than Babsidi's legs, but reached even fewer coherent thoughts than Bren manages.


On the other hand: yay, mecheiti icon becomes more appropriate than ever! :D

Comments

thoughts and reactions, chapters 9-11

[krait]

Observations and miscellanies:

-- Bren puts too much reliance on that nonfatal tea! Just because she didn't want to kill you then doesn't mean she won't off you after having some time to observe you...

-- I love that Bren's junkmail is stolen and sold on the black market! To crazy atevi who think skiing looks like fun and they don't need instructions, they'll just figure it out by pictures and guesswork. *facepalming*

-- Paidhiin have to consult; atevi initially didn't expect this, but it's now known to pretty much all the court in Shejidan. And Bren doesn't think Malguri is less informed than the court. So all the pushing they've been doing (and Tabini, too) -- is completely deliberate, and done in full knowledge that what Bren agrees to is technically out of his authority. Still trying to find out whom he favours?

-- I like the various workarounds humans have developed for diplomacy's sake -- "the numbers describe the universe, and how can the universe be infelicitous?" and the avoidance of any mention of limitlessness/infinity.

-- Tabini calls Ilisidi "my favorite enemy" in his letter! Somehow that really makes me grin. :D

-- I love the idea of an atevi paidhi-to-humans! Wish that had happened! Wish there was a novel about it, too! :D

-- Are there really a dozen "painless" methods of suicide? Especially for a man alone in a dark basement, restrained?

-- EGAD, the balcony scene blows me away! Utterly. "My eyes aren't what they were. When I was your age I could see your orbiting station. Can you, from here?" -- Ilisidi, you are...!

I think part of the impact for me is that Bren has been genuinely, totally clueless until now, and in addition to SO MUCH clicking into place, I'm also wondering what Ilisidi and Cenedi can see on his face in that moment. I suspect that nobody believed just how uninformed he was... And a great deal of their confusion and distrust of his every word was on that account. Now... do they see? Do they believe? That the paidhi is the last to know, that he has had no pressing motive for lying, no inkling that anything more is at stake upon his answers than there was a month ago?

Can they feel empathy at all, for a man in a position distant from and betrayed by his own "aijiin", or is it all their attention still focused on their own plans?

-- Of the sciences left to humans alone, add human history: no one told the atevi about the power struggle between the shipborn and the stationers. Wonder why? Too busy trying to convey the very basics ("We got lost, we had enough fuel to get here, the station broke down and we had nowhere else to go"), and/or present themselves in the best light?

-- Ilisidi's comment that "Tabini placed great confidence in you -- too damned much confidence in you" is a startling mirror of what Bren's been thinking for the last half-book, to wit: "I was too confident in my relationship with Tabini, have I screwed up everything for my species?"

-- Linguistic moment: Ilisidi knows all the good swear-words! "Baji-naji, nand' paidhi. Fortune has a human face and bastard Chance whores drunken down your streets." Given the atevi emphasis on politeness and Bren's commentary on "damn" being verboten, would he even know the words she uses? Maybe only in a "be sure you never, ever mangle a similar word into this" sort of way?

-- Restorative powers of tea! A pot later, Bren's something like back on his game, catching onto the dowager's push/challenge to leave.

Re: thoughts and reactions, chapters 9-11

[pebblerocker]

I worry that if some atevi fool tries out a human sport with home-made equipment and no instruction, and ends up dying, humans could take some of the blame for it...

I hope Ilisidi can read human emotions and see that Bren had no idea about the ship until he saw it from her balcony. Atevi don't show much emotion on their faces, so they will be really good at reading what signs there are, and absolute shock could look similar across species.

Re: thoughts and reactions, chapters 9-11

[krait]

if some atevi fool tries out a human sport with home-made equipment and no instruction, and ends up dying, humans could take some of the blame for it

Eek! I hope not! Unless they can prove a human was responsible for diverting that bit of mail... His security might get in trouble, for not catching the mail-pilferers, too.

Hey, I have a great idea for Bren to make a bit of extra money! He could sell instructional videos for things like skiing. (Waterskiing, too, if he got Toby in on the deal?)

I hope Ilisidi can read human emotions and see that Bren had no idea about the ship

I hope so, too! I found it a little worrying that she said "that's a little too incredible" after watching his reaction... Maybe, to an ateva used to minimal reactions, it looked overdone? Or she didn't trust her own interpretation -- because shock could well look similar, but she knows humans do differ in significant and unexpected ways, and can't rely on reading him?

Hopefully further exposure to Bren will convince her that he's a horrible face-liar unless he's got a script. :D

Re: thoughts and reactions, chapters 9-11

[pebblerocker]

Well, not so much blame for the human most directly responsible, as further ammunition for those who believe nothing good ever came from humans and their ideas...

Yes, he shows so much more on his face that even if the emotion is very similar to what atevi feel, it might be hard for them to believe he's sincere.

Re: thoughts and reactions, chapters 9-11

[krait]

Oh, yes, I could see that! Clearly the aspect ratio of the skis were infelicious, and this was a deliberate attempt at human sabotage... rather than the fact that a ski proportioned to support a human weight may not support an ateva's weight. :P Or ,if no one dies, it's a human plot to encourage the destruction of historic fortresses and mountain trails in favour of human-tech-dependent ski resorts and the traffic they attract!