Yami no Matsuei, Volume 3

[krait]

Finally got cracking on YnM again! Volumes 3 through 7 have been sitting on my coffee table for a month, silently reproaching me.

The third volume is the Cruise Ship Of Doom plotline!


Lots of memorable scenes and beautiful visuals in this volume: Hisoka with a gun (oddly hot),
Tsuzuki in formalwear (expected amounts of hot), Hisoka winning Tsuzuki's body in poker (unreal amounts of hot). :D Practically everybody is extra-pretty in this volume!

We also get the first glimpse of Muraki's 'mark' on Hisoka's body, Hisoka calling Tsuzuki's name while trapped in a nightmare and Tsuzuki being astute enough to deny that Hisoka said anything, and then, as if that's not enough, we get to see both of them tightly embracing at the end while Tsuzuki promises Hisoka he won't end up becoming like his murderer. <3 *whispers* They're bonding!

There were a few funny moments as well, particularly Hisoka blurting out, "like the prostitute?" when Camille introduces herself, and Tsuzuki's musing "and I wouldn't put it past Muraki to drink blood for effect." :D


There were also some things I didn't enjoy.

First: I don't know if it's me or the art style, but I found this volume tricky to read overall. Lots of whooshing motion lines that obscure the actual subject, lots of dialogue or internal monologue where I couldn't determine the speaker.

Second: Hisoka's empathy now encompasses dream-reading, too? I'm suspicious that his talents are going to be plot-dependent instead of having any solid worldbuilding to them. But this is only Volume 3, so I'm trying to apply benefit of the doubt.

Third: The plot here is... sketchy, to say the least. Camille was murdering people because she thought Muraki wanted her to, basically. So somehow a teenaged recent heart-transplant patient was able to run around dismembering adult corpses all night, despite how much strenuous physical effort would be involved?

Fourth: Have you ever read something where it became gradually obvious that the author has A Favourite in the cast, and it's someone you dislike? Yeah, that's happening in spades here. Matsushita looooovvvvessss Muraki and thinks he's awesome and amazing and of course we're all naturally just fascinated by this awesome and amazing character of hers! This slant is very grating as it becomes stronger and more insistent.

As a villain or plot device, I might like Muraki in a love-to-hate-him sense, but the bizarre pressure to fawn over him is making me dislike him in a get-this-guy-off-the-page sense. D:


Overall my reaction to Volume 3 is positive, though! Lots of beautiful scenery, our heroes having Touching Moments (sometimes literally) all over the place, a solid start on weaving in backstories for the leads, and at the end I can bid good riddance to Camille!

I'm sorry for, and proud of, Hisoka for killing her, but I'm happy she's gone and won't be a recurring character. She's the embodiment of a trope I can't stand: Girl With Crush Excuses His Every Character Flaw. (News flash, kid: you can't 'love the man and not the monster,' because they are the same entity! And where did you get that 'he once dedicated himself to saving lives' garbage? He's been an amoral sadistic murderer since before you were born, and doing an illegal transplant for big bucks does not constitute a change of heart.)

Comments

[sholio]

Fourth: Have you ever read something where it became gradually obvious that the author has A Favourite in the cast, and it's someone you dislike? Yeah, that's happening in spades here. Matsushita looooovvvvessss Muraki and thinks he's awesome and amazing and of course we're all naturally just fascinated by this awesome and amazing character of hers! This slant is very grating as it becomes stronger and more insistent.

... you know, it was a really long time ago when I read these (a REALLY long time ago) and I hadn't yet talked over these kinds of things in fandom enough to be consciously aware of some of what I'm aware of now, but I think this exactly nails the feeling I got off Muraki back in the day. I wasn't consciously aware of him as an author's-pet type of character, but I remember being incredibly annoyed that he was around all the time and the narrative seemed to be slanted in a direction of trying to make his creepy fuckery cute rather than awful.

[lynndyre]

Yay! I should reread YnM (except I would totally cheat and just reread the Tatsumi and Watari bits).

I love watching the early art just get better and better- and that's going to continue!

You should be Muraki-free for a bit now, though!

[dancing_serpent]

Seconding your thoughts on Muraki so hard! I was happy about every storyline where he didn't appear. But I also don't like Hisoka all that much (I only like him when I look at him through Tsuzuki's eyes, if that makes sense to you).

On the other hand I'm all about Tsuzuki and his shiki, so my likes/dislikes regarding other characters don't count for much...

[anoyo]

So, I have read this series approximately eighteen thousand times (I was so, so obsessed in high school, it's unreal; my parents actually bought me the whole manga series in Japanese for my birthday one year), and I can comment on some things without spoilers? And be super annoying about it, I'm sure. orz

First: that fucking hug, man. That's probably still one of my very favorite YnM moments ever. ♥

First: I don't know if it's me or the art style, but I found this volume tricky to read overall. Lots of whooshing motion lines that obscure the actual subject, lots of dialogue or internal monologue where I couldn't determine the speaker.

Um, this does not get better. It's a stylistic thing, I'm pretty sure, but eventually each of the characters are unique enough in your mind that it's easier to follow? Or you read it eighteen thousand times and ... then you have them all straight. One of these two things is accurate.

Second: Hisoka's empathy now encompasses dream-reading, too? I'm suspicious that his talents are going to be plot-dependent instead of having any solid worldbuilding to them. But this is only Volume 3, so I'm trying to apply benefit of the doubt.

So, Hisoka's empathy is actually really solid, when you get far enough in, and I can explain it without any spoilers, because it's more an "OH RIGHT" kind of thing. First, let me reassure you that it gets more obviously consistent. Second, any time anyone else has empathy / magic projection / a curse on them / etc. that would cause any sort of psychic-ness, Hisoka is more open to it (much to his great chagrin). What is less consistent is what Tsuzuki can do, which only sort of starts seeming to make sense where the author, you know, bailed on us. *cough*

Third: The plot here is... sketchy, to say the least. Camille was murdering people because she thought Muraki wanted her to, basically. So somehow a teenaged recent heart-transplant patient was able to run around dismembering adult corpses all night, despite how much strenuous physical effort would be involved?

AHAHA. Yes. Realistic, this series is not. (Except in portrayals of trauma and psychological damage, in which case A+ creepily good work, thanks.) BUT ALSO, there was magic involved in the heart transplant, too, because Muraki uses magic in everything ever and is just an epic annoyance to any and all sense-making. The best explanation I heard for this was because the heart was pretty much what was "infecting" her and demanding that she kill, the magic associated with the heart (/Muraki) is what was giving her an extra bit of "oomph." (Once upon a time, getting into super intense meta discussions about this series was a thing.)

Fourth: Have you ever read something where it became gradually obvious that the author has A Favourite in the cast, and it's someone you dislike? Yeah, that's happening in spades here. Matsushita looooovvvvessss Muraki and thinks he's awesome and amazing and of course we're all naturally just fascinated by this awesome and amazing character of hers! This slant is very grating as it becomes stronger and more insistent.

As a villain or plot device, I might like Muraki in a love-to-hate-him sense, but the bizarre pressure to fawn over him is making me dislike him in a get-this-guy-off-the-page sense. D:

So I wrote a really long response to this, and realized it just boils down to: I also fucking hated Muraki and never understood the weird fascination fandom had with his redemption (ugh gross), but eventually Things Happen. Just wait for the Things.

I'm sorry for, and proud of, Hisoka for killing her, but I'm happy she's gone and won't be a recurring character. She's the embodiment of a trope I can't stand: Girl With Crush Excuses His Every Character Flaw. (News flash, kid: you can't 'love the man and not the monster,' because they are the same entity! And where did you get that 'he once dedicated himself to saving lives' garbage? He's been an amoral sadistic murderer since before you were born, and doing an illegal transplant for big bucks does not constitute a change of heart.)

Hisoka's character development is the entire point of this arc, and is beautiful and lovely. He's supposed to stand in juxtaposition to Camille for this very reason: she goes crazy in one way, and he went crazy in another, but both had the same potentialities. Also, um, without spoilers, there is way more detail in the manga than in the anime about Muraki, so just wait for it? (None of it redeems him, in my opinion. Not a damn piece.)

I LOVE THIS SERIES. I recently rewatched the anime, and boy did it not age well, but the manga holds up. There are parts of the YnM manga that are some of my very favorite moments and storytelling devices, even fifteen years later. ♥

(Here, have a super relevant icon, too.)

[anoyo]

So, I got weirdly reminiscent and went back through my YnM tag and found a post about my buying volume three of YnM in English when it came out. Um. It's here, with warnings for, you know, having been in high school at the time. So, apparently a few of the issues with volume three are that the translation is wrong. Which apparently I used to remember. I know there's a longer post by one of my friends about it, but: whoops. I read all of the scanlations before the manga or anime actually got legally translated, because I was that kind of teenager. JFC.

[krait]

It was... really blatant in this volume. Incredibly blatant. Heavy-handed, even. The author's waving a banner for her affections and her expectation that we share it, particularly in the little 'author speaks' side-columns:

And... this is obvious, I know but... that doctor is totally crazy. He won't let anything stop him from getting what he wants (tee hee). That's okay. All that matters is that he's having fun. That's the way his character is, so why fight it?

Later on we get If you're wondering why a Japanese doctor has blonde hair, well... it's a secret. You'll find out when you learn about his family and his family tree. I hope you're looking forward to it!!

And immediately after the rape flashback: I know it was humiliating, but hang in there [Hisoka], maybe you'll get Muraki in the end. (Not like that, you pervs!)

The next one is Sorry Muraki was gone for so long! At least he was full of, erm, vim and vigor as soon as he awoke. He's a player, that guy.

The last one concludes with One day, I'd like to write Muraki's history. What was he like as a child? Hmm. Sounds fun, doesn't it? (I'm still talking about the doctor... I'm obsessed.) Well, see you next time!

Each bit was more grating than the last. Like that one uncle who makes awful jokes and keeps elbowing you with "Eh? Eh?" like he thinks you've missed the punchline or have somehow forgotten how to laugh.

[krait]

You should totally reread! I can't even blame you if you make it a partial reread; I'm already tempted to start skimming every time Muraki starts talking. :P

[krait]

All right, another downvote for Muraki. :D Clearly we all have good taste in internet friends.

I definitely like Hisoka a lot, but I understand somebody else's affection making a character more enjoyable! I wish there was more outside-POV fic for this fandom.

I like Tsuzuki, too! Haven't met the shiki yet (except in the anime version, of course) but I am not going into this completely unspoiled - I've read a whole lot of fic already - so I have an idea of what to look forward to when the shiki appear. :D

[krait]

Comment away! And no worries; considering it's a decades-old series, I've watched the anime, AND I've read all the fic over 5K on AO3, this reread isn't something I'm facing completely unspoiled. :D If spoilers slip in, I might not even notice.

THAT HUG. AGREE 100% ON 'BEST MOMENTS' SENTIMENT. <3

Well, at least I have an encouraging answer on 'is this hard to follow or is it just me?' :D Thanks for the warning; I will try to get better at distinguishing everybody! Sadly I think I mix up Muraki and Tsuzuki the most (tall dude with windswept bangs, other tall dude with windswept bangs, and in this volume they're both wearing suits to boot) which is REALLY confusing. Can't they wear name badges?

Thanks also for the reassurance regarding magic-powers worldbuilding; I look forward to more information!

never understood the weird fascination fandom had with his redemption

This is definitely something I've noticed! And a lot of them don't even bother with the redemption, they just declare him to be a misunderstood woobie and go from there. D:< I guess they have picked up the author's weird love for him, but it's still baffling and leads to a lot of backclicking on fics.

Hisoka's character development makes me so happy! The contrasts with Camille, who was also influenced by Muraki at a young age, are great, too. Camille became like Muraki, but Hisoka did not (though he's not convinced of it). Camille murdered people who might have supported her, but Hisoka hugs his partner and is told he won't let Hisoka follow that path. Camille killed at someone else's command, but Hisoka killed only upon request.

Interesting that Muraki was kind to Camille and cruel to Hisoka, considering how each turned out.

ICON LOVE. ♥

[anoyo]

And no worries; considering it's a decades-old series, I've watched the anime, AND I've read all the fic over 5K on AO3, this reread isn't something I'm facing completely unspoiled. :D If spoilers slip in, I might not even notice.

IT'S SO TRUE. Man. I hope you read the one I got for not_primetime last year. Oh my gosh, so, so good. But massive manga spoilers and kind of assumes you've read Hisoka's Shiki arc.

HAHAHA. Name badges. Um, it's mostly the eyes that distinguish the characters in this one. Like, the eyes are all different. They help. But also really just the tone of conversation.

Worldbuilding: the series gets better as it goes. Really. The worldbuilding starts out not great, but it gets better. (E.g., Hisoka having empathy powers that are New and Different.)

Yeah, I avoided a lot of anything that had Muraki in the lead while reading YnM fic. Most of the really good YnM fic still isn't on AO3 (and may never be), so fanfiction.net is actually a fairly decent resource, if you go far enough back in time. (I could probably find some recs? If you haven't explored ffNET and LiveJournal yet.)

[dancing_serpent]

So, apparently a few of the issues with volume three are that the translation is wrong.

That explains so much. *g* Once upon a time I had the stupid idea lofty goal to compare the translations I read to the Japanese original. Because I started out with the German translation, then bought the English one (for fic writing purposes), and soon noticed that there were differences - things I wouldn't have translated from English to German or the other way round - and I really wanted to know which translation was closer to the Japanese original.

Of course, my Japanese wasn't all that great back then, but at least I was still taking courses. By now...yeah, better not speak of that. *g*

Anyway, that's the reason why I have the whole of YnM in German, English and Japanese lying around. *g*

[anoyo]

Hahaha! That's awesome. Yeah, the English translation is the one I was finding issues with. I'll admit that I don't own any manga outside of English/Japanese, excepting one in Spanish. (I thought about collecting them in French back when I was ~mostly fluent, but today I don't think I could parse my way through. Whoops.)

[dancing_serpent]

Oh, I have so many wishes regarding fanfic in this fandom! When I filter out all the Muraki and Hisoka, there's not much left for me. *g* But so much yes for outsider-POV! That's one of my favourite thing in fanfic.

And now I'm really thinking about a re-read...

[krait]

I may have read your n_pt fic! I certainly read a couple that referenced Hisoka {attempting} to gain a shiki. :D

The tone of the conversation would be easier to distinguish if I knew who was talking! Several times there were just... words... floating freely across the page... and it was difficult for me to tell who was saying them, or even if they were being said aloud or just thought.

(This is where I admit ruefully that I am really Not Good At Comics. It's one reason I really never got into reading manga until I was in my late 20s-early 30s; it's prohibitively expensive, I read it very quickly, and I miss a lot while reading because I only look at the words! I'm do think I'm improving, though!)

Most of what's on AO3 I've seen, but I haven't gone diving on LJ or FFN yet, so recs from those sites are more than welcome!