further thoughts on anonymity

[krait]

Still musing over my reactions to a mandatory anon policy, and though I haven't reached any major conclusions, I've made some further inroads into mapping out my reactions.

First, a small revelation: I went back and read the comm's rules, and while they're still a big damp blanket over my enthusiasm, I have at least determined that I misread one thing that had concerned me, and archiving fic written for the meme is allowed. (You're not allowed to link to the archived version on the meme itself, though, which puts me right back in the irked!Lance position.)

Second: Bits that irritate me the most include the 'explanation' of the anonymity policy, in which I'm informed that the "best way" to avoid kink-shaming is to enforce anonymity. Which sounds a lot, to me, like: "No one should say anything bad about anyone's kink. The way to do this is to keep anyone from acknowledging that they have a kink." -- Wait, what?

I find that I disagree entirely -- I think the 'best way' to handle it is to let people choose their comfort level regarding openness, especially given the emphasis placed on "do not engage trolls, report offences to the moderators" elsewhere in the policy. If the meme is already set up to handle trolling, how does forcing everyone into anonymity further this goal? Wouldn't it be just as kink-positive to let those who are comfortable with it be role models against shaming?

Third: All right, I'm still working on a third. :D Except the voice near my cerebellum pointing out that the "no linking to an archived version" thing feeds right back into this -- I can write a kink anonymously, and I can post that kink on, say, AO3 under my own name... but I'm not allowed to let the person who requested it know that I wrote it? Someone who, justifiably, is probably pretty interested in knowing they're not alone in their kink, and might like to have a perma-link version of the story written for them? Baffling to me, not to mention frustrating!

Comments

[pantswarrior]

I have at least determined that I misread one thing that had concerned me, and archiving fic written for the meme is allowed.

If you've been referring to the same meme I think you're referring to, you didn't misread. I asked a very specific question on the LJ version of the post - because I was no way going to take part in a meme that wouldn't let you EVER EVER NO WAY post your own work under your own name later. Although I do agree with the "stay anonymous on the meme" stance, not permitting artists and authors to take any credit for their own work anywhere is just plain stupid. After I asked about this, they said they'd edit the rules to make that clear.

(And if you are indeed referring to the same meme, I'm extremely glad for the forced anonymity myself, because there are a handful of serious BNFs that have intimidated newbies. And not only that, but one of them is... well, let's just say she seems to enjoy that a lot. So while nearly everyone else would no doubt be doing the "omg YOU wrote something for me, best day of my life" thing, I and others who know about this stuff would be grinding our teeth every time she jumped in with her username and made yet another grab for fandom domination. Much better to have all fic on an even setting.)

As it stands, it seems fairly similar to how the Tiger & Bunny meme is set up, and you CONSTANTLY have people there "de-anoning" for fic or art on the main community. As far as I know, that's permitted, and thus the prompter can stay informed if they're that interested.

[snakeling]

I tend to agree with ferdelance about forced anonymity, but your explanation re: fandom politics makes a lot of sense. I understand why, in this context, mods prefer to enforce a strict anonymity policy.

That said, not being able to link to a non-anonymous fic at the end of the meme is annoying. I know that the first time I do when I'm linked to the kink_meme for my fandom is to scroll down and see whether the OP has posted a archival link, because it's both easier to read and easier to bookmark.

[pantswarrior]

Heheh, re: fandom politics, I sort of suspect that (if we are talking about the same fandom) the aforementioned BNF's inner circle is already throwing friends-locked hissy-fits due to certain details mentioned in the meme introduction. But darnit, she does NOT run the fandom, and I'm thinking based on those details that whoever started the meme is someone who knows the situation, which may be why the rules were instituted in such a way. Or maybe whoever started the meme has been in a fandom with fans like that one. :P

And yeah, archival links are extremely useful! I'd be all for those after the work has been finished, and the initial feedback received on something other than name-recognition. Or in the case of something that winds up so long it has to be chaptered; one meme I'm on doesn't care if you're anonymous or not, so when I wound up accidentally writing a gigantic plotty genfic, it was such a relief to just post it at AO3 and go "Rather than spend 100+ comments on this, here you go."

[krait]

first thing I do when I'm linked to the kink_meme for my fandom is to scroll down and see whether the OP has posted a archival link

Me, too! It's just so much easier for reading/bookmarking/reccing.

The second thing I do is try to see if the writer has their username anywhere in the posting, to track them down and see if they've archived it in their own journal... :D

[krait]

I think it must be a different meme, or else the rules were changed after your asking, because this is the official phrasing:

Feel free to archive your fanfiction/fanart anywhere you like under your own name or pseudonym after sharing it here; however, you must remain anonymous on the meme itself

which sounds to me as though one can archive the work under one's own name after posting anonymously, but cannot link to the archived story on the meme.

extremely glad for the forced anonymity myself, because there are a handful of serious BNFs that have intimidated newbies.

Hmmm... I think either I am shockingly out of the loop for this fandom (possible; somehow wank always seems to skirt the edges of my awareness), or it's a different fandom you're thinking of (also possible: I'm not sure there are 'newbies' as such in the one I'm thinking of, though again that could be a lack of involvement on my part).

I'm thinking of a fandom with two main characters, tall-dark-and-violent versus tall-fair-and-flirtatious; source material dates to the 1970s... sound like what you were thinking of? :D

and you CONSTANTLY have people there "de-anoning" for fic or art on the main community. As far as I know, that's permitted

This sounds rather more like the ST:XI and BBC Sherlock memes, both of which I have spent hours and hours and hours! time in -- especially the former, where prompters and fillers alike often didn't bother with anon at all. (Myself included. I am now officially on the internet record as having encouraged some anon's little necro-prompt!) The entire attitude struck me as being very laid-back and accepting on that meme, and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

[pantswarrior]

Heh, nope, sounds like we're talking about the same meme. It's not that you're "out of the loop" about the wank in this fandom, so much as a lot of it happened via email and locked posts. I only found out because I referenced something from Fandom Wank in a post, and one of the more directly involved parties, who I already was getting on well with, sent me a private message and went "Hey, since you read FW, you probably would be amused by what's been going on..." But no one is interested in airing the dirty laundry in public, since on the surface it seems like a sensible, mature fandom!

And by newbies, I'm talking about new people who have shown up during the time I've been a part of the fandom, when they first showed up. (Given the age of the fandom, I still kind of feel like a n00b myself. ;)) We don't get a LOT of new people, but every now and then we get one.

This sounds rather more like the ST:XI and BBC Sherlock memes, both of which I have spent hours and hours and hours! time in -- especially the former, where prompters and fillers alike often didn't bother with anon at all.

Nah, I spent a little time on the former (enjoyed the TOS meme more :D), and I think it works there because ST:XI is too huge and too new to really have cliques. (BBC Sherlock I'm not in the fandom for, but considering how many people I know talk about it, it seems to be similar.) Tiger & Bunny, for instance, may be too new, but not so gigantic and overwhelmed with different people posting that people wouldn't remember a username who posted their favorite fic (though the anonymity on the meme I think helps prevent BNF syndrome for the most part). This fandom being neither new or huge, and already sort of cliquey, I could imagine it not going well if people didn't maintain anonymity on the meme.

In fact, even though this meme would be all anon, I'm sort of looking forward to filling some prompts if any ever get posted, just so that I personally know someone's posting other than a single other person. :P

[krait]

Ah, okay -- yes, I was even more of a lurker back before the English version of the source came out (which was also pretty much pre-"LJ as fandom central"), so if the wankery was going on back then, no wonder I missed it. Thankfully, I guess, since I was a real newbie back then -- it was one of my first fandoms, so I might have been less fireproof then... :D

I think it works there because ST:XI is too huge and too new to really have cliques.

That was my main hypothesis. :D Note to newbies: choose large, new fandoms for your first forays into fannishness!

even though this meme would be all anon, I'm sort of looking forward to filling some prompts if any ever get posted

I have been thinking up ways to get around the bits of this meme that irk me most, and I think there ought to be a method whereby a filler could archive the fic elsewhere, give the mods the archive link, and then post anonymously "This fic has been archived offsite; contact the mods for a link".

Given I have no idea how many mods there are or how obstinately welded to the current setup they are, I haven't actually suggested this anywhere, but I'm vaguely thinking about it...